From: billc@minerva.phyast.pitt.edu (Morbius)
Newsgroups: alt.atheism,alt.christnet.hypocracy,alt.recovery.catholicism,alt.recovery.religion
Subject: Re: Why *I* am a Christian (Part 1)
Date: 10 Nov 1994 23:45:57 GMT
Organization: Department of Physics & Astronomy, University of Pittsburgh
Lines: 50

In article <dcon-0911941333370001@128.96.71.70> dcon@cc.bellcore.com (Dan Connolly) writes:
:In article <39phid$f1l@usenet.srv.cis.pitt.edu>,
:billc@minerva.phyast.pitt.edu (Morbius) wrote:
:
:> In article <dcon-0711941053030001@128.96.71.70> dcon@cc.bellcore.com
:(Dan Connolly) writes:
:> :Quantum Mechanics as a theory used to explain phenomena like radioactive
:> :decay  is quite helpful.  However, the implications of Quantum Theory as
:> :they apply to things like "causality" are extremely controversial.  I
:>                                                                    ^^^^^^
:> :suggest you read "God and the New Physics" by Paul Davies for an excellent
:>  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
:> :treatment of this subject.
:> 
:> I suggest that you read this book again. In it, Davies quite thoroughly
:> demolishes the first cause argument. Hawkings' _A Brief History of Time_
:> does the same.
:
:As I suggested before, Quantum Theory exposes First Cause to doubt (as
:Davies says on pg. 42).  However, he did not "thoroughly demolish" the
:First Cause argument.  He merely showed some of its problems in light of
:quantum physics and what some of the alternatives were.  He also mentioned
:some of the reasons why proponents of First Cause still hold it to be true
:even for quantum events.  He says this about removing the need for
:causality - "Nevertheless one is still left with a feeling of unease."


The first cause argument attempts to show that the universe must have had
a cause, and that cause is God. It can be demolished by showing how the 
universe can exist without having been caused. 

Stephen Hawking's "No Boundary" model is an example of a universe 
without a cause. In _A Brief History of Time_, p.136, he says:

      "The universe would be completely self-contained and not
      affected by anything outside itself. It would neither be
      created nor destroyed. It would just BE."

Now you may argue that Hawking's model has not been proven to be true,
but that is irrelevant. What is important is that it provides a
counter-example to the (unsupported) claim that the universe *must*
have had a cause. That is enough to demolish the first cause 
argument.


-Morbius